I HAVE NEVER ACTUALLY TRIED FOR A MEDICAL OR A LISENSE AS FAR AS THAT GOES. At medical renewal you give a different date for same previously reported event. Politicians create government agencies empowered to rule by edict. At worse, you may face a hefty fine or even criminal prosecution. the third class should go away. Of those, only a very small % are from medical causes. He refused to take the physical his business required because his family had a history of heart trouble, he was a bit overweight, etc. I hadnt had any issues or symptoms for over 10 yrs., doctors Id seen always pronounced me fit & healthy. If you did go fly one, it would be a violation of the Sport Pilot rule on self certification. The AME is there to help you get a medical LEGALLY when you have one or more disqualifying conditions. Im a late student and cancer survivor and the FAA takes three months to get my student permit back and it expires in nine months. Investigating complaints from citizens and co-workers. Now that I have no further problems I have to take an Awake and Alert test annually. Make no mistake,I have no problem with after finding an issue,we get it taken care of. How is that fair? Now, what other activity with a rate of death this low has a major federal bureaucracy policing it? All FAA medical certificate applicants are required to acknowledge that warning before submitting their application in MedXPress. However, if you do get caught, at best you will lose your license. Makes no logical sense. He exists to remove one of the joys of my life. When I joined the military, it popped up at MEPs and I had to complete a waiver but I was allowed to go to boot camp. Ok, I read the revised FAA 61.53 and I have been under a misconception; however, there are most likely many others who believe like I did. then are able to re-apply. Robert Davis Travel Management Consultant, 2023 Executive Flyers +1 (512) 241-0795. Willy post had only one eye should he have been grounded.??? I told the truth (that I had a very early-stage, very treatable cancer) and had my medical yanked. If you succeed in running that gauntlet, there is something else to consider. I aeree. All I wish is that they would figure out a way to distinguish between a lie and an honest omission. If thats not a bigger threat to safety, I dont know what is. They didnt even send him a letter informing him about his conduct. The FAA makes it clear what counts as a disqualifying condition. BUT I HAVE 40+ YEARS AND 5100 HRS OF PIC IN MY OWN AIR CRAFT WITH OUT INCIDENT OR ACCIDENT. In reality, all pilots (no matter what their license) self-certify their fitness to fly every time they fly. Everyone should say they have been dizzy. Some do it by mistake. While my husband sailed through after having lied. The MedXPress application In order to understand how likely it is the FAA would catch you lying, it is important to understand how they would catch you. I gave up on my dreams. Yes, most people that love to fly do what they can to preserve their ability to do so. Im depressed, so their answer is to tell me I cant do anything to fix my problem whilst simultaneously denying me something that significantly helps with my depression: Flying? How about an 83 year-old on medication for type II diabetes, depression, and senility taking medication for all 3 problems? Speaking as a pilot, I think that there should be a way to maintain certification for those of us flying recreationally without having to see an AME every 2 years. Where is the limit to government infringement? This is especially true of hearing. For instance, in the Minnesota test I have written that I dont like snakes and I was denied the 1st class medical because they thought I have a nevrotic personality. This is a bit off the subject of lying on the 8500-8, but it addresses another approach to not requiring a medical examination for certain types of flying. Of course they do. I can empathize with that Louis. Pilots most likely have wanted too fly since they were kids. I really want to fly but Im not sure my passion, not to mention my wallet, will be enough to get me through this process. According to Dr. Guillermo J. Salazar, the federal flight surgeon for the Southwest Region, applicants filling out Form 8500-8 often skip Block 17, which asks about medications, rather than spill the beans. You do not have to be Richard Collins or Ernest Gann simply a GA pilot with a story youd share with friends sitting in the hangar. One change I would like in the current procedure for the special issuance is to have my AME rather than those in Oklohoma City decide if I am healthy enough to fly. Thats if they even decide to give you a medical waiver. They will also review how your current application compares to the ones you have submitted in the past and your driving record. With a second class medical, itll be 12 calendar months, and if you start with the third class medical, itll be for 24 calendar months. I greatly respect him, and therefore, I must meter the information I give him about my own medical problems ungood! I can get it back, but I have to go through a fairly extensive bureaucratic morass to recover it, then jump through extra hoops over the years to keep it. Managing a flight department or want to offer a premium service to your club members or students. before an incident so we know how to correct. The Third Class is an absolute joke. Im sorry to hear about your bad experience. Water under the bridge now 19 years later. What can some shrink tell me about myself that I dont already know? An applicant who knowingly misrepresents the facts and gets caught can lose his or her pilot license forever and face a fine of up to $250,000, imprisonment for up to five years, or both. have you ever once in your life had and on the other hand they are so vague. This is because you know you have a condition that would disqualify you if you did apply for a Third Class medical. However, a few years later when I needed to take a 2nd class physical, I could not pass because of the hearing problem and the AMI made an appointment for me with the FAAs regional medical representative. After 7 years and three more third class medicals-the FAA medical office suddenly decided I had 30 days to provide all the records from a condition I had 20 years ago, or have my medical suspended. The medical only looks at your health at the point in time. There are folks flying with diabetes that are on insulin. If you ever need to submit medical records to the FAA, they will review everything you give them. I need some advice from experienced pilots / medical professionals about a problem. SOO going by the statistic that YOU pointed outof very few incidents and the comments that have been made that alot of piolts tell little white lies to an AME to keep their medical . I would like to see how many incidents of NOT seeking medical attention, due to knowing that the FAA will pull their ticket, have led to problems. I have to say, this doc was thorough, checked everything, but, when he saw that attachment with all that exposure, he looked at me in a way like what is all this. If your medical expires, there is nothing to stop you from continuing to fly. We have an entrenched bureaucracy that refuses to relinquish power and money. I dont think its ever been a question about whether pilots lie. I lost my career as an airline pilot (major airline) and my life spiraled out of control. He then went on to work for the leading aviation magazines, including as editor of both AOPA Pilot and Flying. Brian, what about a medication that was rx when you were eight and havent taken for 20yrs? Of course, as others have posted here NO ONE can truthfully answer no to all the questions because of ever. Furthermore if one has the right against self-incrimination in court testimony, why should one be forced to self-incriminate before a Federal Agency that is extremely bureaucratic, slow to change, and out of touch with reality? I fly a Cirrus, my wife knows how to pull the parachute. Would I report this or any depression on the 8500-8? Its a basic truth of the human condition that everybody lies. Because they can longer fly. They will, however, not issue a medical when it is applied for in the future. Sometimes I think its not necessary for ATC people to have medicals. No he should not have been grounded. He proceeded to read off the list and after a half dozen items to which I responded No, he said You wouldnt tell me if you had any of these, would you? They are actually almost the same as for Third Class. Sure BUT would that condition really effect his flying? His first action was to pull out a form with three columns of Have you ever? items each requiring a yes/no response. You just never know, and even a thorough and honest medical will never catch anything. But most of disqualifying conditions can be dealt with, and your AME should help you do that. This exemption is exactly what I need to keep flying, and I am sure there are many others like me. This does not mean that the AME should ignore any disqualifying condition that you might have. Anyway if your willing I have a ton of questions for you. By the way a friend of mine died 2 hours after acquiring his 2nd class medical. First, if youve not taken a disqualifying medication for greater than 90 days, you can potentially argue to the FAA that your underlying diagnosis was not accurate to begin with. I would love to see the third class go away, but I doubt any government agency will voluntarily give up any turf. Special Issuance medical exams can cost more. And maintaining a Commercial Driver License with some illnesses is more difficult than maintaining and FAA Medical Certificate. I understand why a lot of this stuff, like the sport pilot initiative, takes so long and always falls short, but cmon, this one is easy and its gonna bite them in the ass. Period. It's usually the "have you ever" questions. But, it was not the fault of the FAA, it was mine for not verifying the doctors statement before submitting it. The Federal Aviation Regulations and U.S. law require that FAA Form 8500-8, the application for a medical certificate, be filled out completely and truthfully'or else. I am very curious. Learn more here: thepilotlawyer.com/faa-medical/. If somebody had an experience with this, or knows somebody who has had that would be great if they are willing to share. Office hours M-F 8:30am - 5:00pmOur Privacy Find another AME. If pilots routinely lie, but its never a safety issue 5 years until age 40, then 4 years until age 45, then 3 years until age 50, then 2 years. I hid it from the FAA for 12 years They found out I didnt disclose it and revoked ALL my certificates ATP multi-single engine land, Commercial rotorcraft and glider as well as all my flight instructor certificates. However, if you do get caught, at best you will lose your license. Told the truth, The FAA took my license. With that framework in mind, it should be obvious that the FAA has a number of overlapping methods to catch you lying on your flight physical application. His point is that no one requires commercial I have no problem with the current system. thank you, that will be $110. A good AME will grease the skids for you, but dont expect the AME to overlook a problem. hej Jim, you couldnt describe better the current situation: from Aryan superman to weelchair pilot. Online posts, including anonymous posts and posts made here on APC, have been used in lawsuits against unions. Anyone who would report this immediately loses their medical and has to wait a year. Some other government agency gets told another. And the Medical Flight Test needs to be taken only once and the SODA is good indefinitely. so.does everyone repeat their whole life medical history.or just the recent stuff since the last medical exam? Has anyone seen that data? Having spent over 10k learning to fly I was advised at my medical I had LBBB. Think about what the FAA is likely to be interested in: Onset of chronic disease, like high blood pressure or type II diabetes. Once set up by politicians, these agencies rule by fiat, for which there is no recourse. The FAA is not there to police, but to screen, monitor, and facilitate the safety of the public with respect to aviation. All content on Executive Flyers is rigorously reviewed by experienced and qualified fact-checkers. However, if you do get caught, at best you will lose your license. Fly with a friend and share expenses, help a youngster learn to fly and let them fly you around in your plane. Since LSA pilots need no physical, why should non-commercial pilots flying require a Class 3 medical? Logic dictates that if the medical requirement did not exist, the number of incapacitations would be somewhat higher. Reply. Today with the revolution in the medical diagnostic procedures, and early detection system and timely treatment most airline pilots will qualify and pass the medical exam if the questions were not leading ones. The message the FAA should be sending to pilots in my opinion is Manage your health. Get thorough guidance on how to proceed. The answer is that the population would not tolerate it. According to Pilot Self-Grounding Requirements (CFR 61.53), pilots have the duty to ground themselves and report to the FAA any changes in their medical condition before they are able to fly again. I avoid medical intervention like the plague. In other words, your health is in your hands. Flying brought some much needed joy back into my life. People who are actually depressed long term are not really at risk of doing things like this if they were, they wouldnt be here to start with. Maybe I misunderstood the content regarding flagging his file, maybe this is an appropriate means of discipline, they did not elaborate. See Also: Do Flight Schools Drug Test Students? and moved on to checking the no column for the rest of the page. You can be a Sport Pilot if you have never had your FAA medical denied. No further action by AWP-300. Federal Air Surgeon Jon Jordan is very aware of the FAA fear factor among pilots who worry about the potential consequences of filling out the form truthfully. As a 74 year old pilot, I feel that seeing the Aviation Doc every two years is good for my health. Because you were probably the kid who sat at the front of the classroom and said yes teacher whatever you want teacher. Took the FAA medical (stand on this leg, stand on that leg can you see anything out of this eye, can you see anything out of that eye). I lost my younger years flying and now the hoopes I have to jump through is unbeleveable.I really love flying but the government can take the privelage away its not right. Look at that, all 4 of them had a diagnosis from the VA. More than anything, this should be pressing the FAA to adjust how they look at mental illness and flying. Some of us just have problems in our lives that are difficult to deal with. Stan, what is the diagnosis for which you have special issuance? One just hopes that the untruths are regarding minor medical issues they feel will disqualify them that wont compromise their safety as well as all others around them. The FAA gives final denial to only 0.01% of applications. I used to go up about twice a week; now I havent flown since August. Dont take it personally, those are just the facts on the ground. Whether or not your AME issues your medical certificate, the FAAs Aeromedical Certification Division (AMCD) will review your application. Address: PO Box 11 West Liberty, KY 41472, Email: Anthony@ThePilotLawyer.com | Christopher@ThePilotLawyer.com, Office Hours: Mon - Thu, 9:00 AM to 5:00 PM (Eastern Time Zone)Fri, 9:00 AM to 12:00 PM (Eastern Time Zone)Messages left for attorneys after these business hours will be addressed the following business day, during business hours, The Ison Law Firm offers FAA defense nationwide from our offices in Florida and Kentucky, Lakeland Web Design by BrightSky Web Design, Messages left for attorneys after these business hours will be addressed the following business day, during business hours, https://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/avs/offices/aam/ame/guide/dec_cons/disease_prot/adhd/, Assessment for Sleep Apnea During Your FAA Medical, FAA Medical Certificate and Benign Prostatic Hyperplasia. He issued my medical with a waiver. If you cant pass the physical you need to find another way to fly. A medical exam is required for a Commercial Driver License and for working on a commercial boat carrying passengers. Question:Do you think most pilots fib on applications for medical certificates? Theres also the issue of things that a doctor may speculate on that they have no training or qualifications to formally diagnose. Me- private pilot ASEL, Airplane Instrument, flying since 1986. I definitely do not lie on my medical application (8500-8) form because its a legal instrument. Im about done flying, it is expensive enough without the FAA making it more so needlessly. frankly I aint go no reason to lie,,,but anybody else wants to up to them,ur lic at stake..jus hope u dont endanger anybody else..if its serious..ur life at stake alsow/everybody else below youso happy flying w/clear consciousRex. Mr. Diabetes can still legally fly as a sport pilot. Simply having an assault on record does not by itself result in denial. Just like the annual inspection on the aircraft, when it was signed off everything was supposed to be airworthy, what happens after that is anyones guess. The other crewmembers will consult the seniority list to see how they fare after my death. Hes very consciencious, and does not tolerate much in the way of obfuscation, at which he appears to be very good at spotting. The whole thing is about safety but the FAA has never proven the need for the medicals, especially the third class, it was just randomly instituted one day a long time ago. If you do or don't disclose, that's your business. Smaller countries use the FAA regulations for medical certification and, therefore, use the 8500-8 form and have it submitted to the FAA for approval. From the archives: how valuable are check rides? The Aerospace Medical Certification Subsystem (AMCS) has been enhanced to provide the capability to print Airman Medical or Airman Medical and Student Pilot Certificates. Some Pilots tend to lie some just do not get medicals. The FAA can get your records from Social Security if you are on Medicare. Like everything els not all AMEs are created equally. If the FAA finds out that you failed to disclose something that you should have disclosed, not only does it mean that you can lose your license, but you may also face a hefty fine or even criminal prosecution. With the right preparation, you can navigate the process efficiently. I am all in favour of your own doctors certificate of good health. Federal employees should qualify for at least a class three medical for airmen and let us toss in the medication list and drug testing for commercial drivers. I took medication for years, before I decided I didn't like and chose to stop taking meds (with my parents). You definitely need to be in pretty good shape physically and mentally to be PIC, but I am really discouraged by the heavy-handed, intrusive, and IMHO borderline incompetent way the special issuance process works. The current system not only encourages dishonesty, it encourages pilots to avoid medical treatment and ignore symptoms. If they claim pilots and truck drivers are more important or have a larger impact then ask why the average federal bureaucrat is paid so much. But with such a vague statement, you can see why many pilots may unintentionally get themselves into trouble. Each time the Dr. hit the switch, my friend kicked me under the table and I could respond that I had heard the tone in the headset as required. Heres a guy who was never diagnosed with depression or showed any signs of it, but still completed the act so feared by these administrators. This has little or nothing to do with safety, but everything to do with preserving bureaucratic fiefdoms. Two of the pilots I know of with these problems have Class 1 Medical Certificates. Deliberate falsification on the medical form is a crime punishable by imprisonment and large fines (read the form, folks), and any losses wont be covered by your insurer. I can tell you from experience that once the AME releases their pronouncement, nothing else occurs. So why are private pilots singled out for this rediculous harrassment ? It doesnt seem to exhibit much intelligence to uselessly act excited after the fact instead of before. If the problem for which you have special issuance no longer exists, ask the FAA to cancel the SI. Type II diabetes, coronary artery stents, history of myocardial infarction (heart attack), various cancers, and several other diseases are disqualifying, but Special Issuance can be obtained by doing the hoop jumping that the FAA requires, such as providing a statement from your treating physician, listing the medications that you take, do you have any side effects from the medications, do the medications actually work. I agree the sport licensse should include at least up to a 152, super cub and all two seat trainers. Due to the self-reporting nature, the chances of getting caught lying on an FAA medical aren't very high. Should that person be allowed to self-certified medically and carry as many as 5 passengers? PERIOD. Simple you dont need to know and if you are scared to apply for you medical because your feared in getting caught. Unfortunatley I have seen too many accident reports where the pilot was on prescription medications (found during the toxicological examination)many of them disqulifying, and none of them were reported on the medical application. If you submit something on your MedXPresss application that does not agree with previous applications, that can trigger an in-depth review, Your AME can defer your application for any reason that will most like result in further information requests, The FAA could request information based on the results of your driving record search, For military veterans, disagreement between your MedXPress application and your VA disability ratings often earns a letter from the FAA. Criminal prosecution been a question about whether pilots lie releases their pronouncement, nothing else.... Mine for not verifying the doctors statement before submitting it give a different date for same previously reported.! 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